[MoPar_Jamie]

As most know, my 360 in the D-200 is practically ruined! Oh sure, it still running, but not sounding well at all! Sypnosis:

Been acting up since Monday I think when I went to pass a Truck, had to manually downshift to second cause I didnt stomp it hard enough! From then on it was lifter tick! Well, that has escallated into the rod bearings going out, can hear a "Braaa" sound on acceleration. No mistaking it for anything other than a bearing going in the lower end!

Also can hear it going down the road steady, varying in volume!

So, am I correct in assuming that its a rod bearing?

And the big one, what likely went on/is going on down below?

 

[phoenix827]

when you downshifet did it rev WAY up? Might have spun a bearing. I got lucky with mine, droped back into place about 10 min later! Don't count on that though.

 

[Guest]

It could be a rod bearing. the only way to tell for sure is to pull the pan and check.

 

[MoPar_Jamie]

Well, it DID rev up a bit, no more than normal I thought and I didnt keep it in second long! The thing is, I didnt notice the lower end noise until just yesterday! The only thing real pronounced was the lifter tick, and it started off slight and got worse!

I've got to pull the pan anyway, so I'll be able to check it out!

 

[Smokey]

The simple answer is, you may very well have cratered your crank.... especially by continuing to drive after the rattle started.

You didn't tell us what the oil pressure gauge was reading during and after this adventure... It is unlikely, but possible that the oil pump chose that moment to go out, or the oil pickup fell off, or....

So yeah, get it apart to see what's up.

 

[MoPar_Jamie]

I'm with Jay on that one, how in the world did it spin back into place? The one engine (a slant) I tore paprt had a spun bearing, but it was wrapped around the crank journal! Had to split it to get it off!

AS for my Truck, tore the intake and valve covers off, all was well! I didnt see any galling on the lobes or anything! Pulled the pump drive out, it was just fine!

The wierdest thing was that the lft (drivers) side bank had solid-feeling lifters, couldnt compress em! The other side, almost all you could compress, even on intake/exhaust strokes! Wonder if somehow that one side lost pressure? I dont see how that is possible with whats going on down below, but hey, anythings possible!

 

[Smokey]

You took the wrong side apart doodoo.... the rods and mains are in the oil pan, not the rocker covers

And, you can't really see the "lobes" (cam lobes) by removing the rocker covers...

Don't try to bullshit a bullshitter....

And, on that note, I'd be surprised as hell if a rod bearing "reseated"; musta been something else banging.

 

[phoenix827]

when you downshifet did it rev WAY up? Might have spun a bearing. I got lucky with mine, droped back into place about 10 min later! Don't count on that though.

Ummmm,..........what? You're saying that you spun a bearing, and that it actually spun back into position?
Jay

Guess so, never heard another peep out of it! Pretty sure if it just fell out it would have at least stayed the same if not gotten worse. (and no this was not on a honda! ) Had the car for about a year after that and never had a prob with it. Of course when I sold it the guy put a blower on it and it lasted about 2 weeks!! Blew the whole bottom end apart he said!! Gotta love that motor!! (1981 pontiac phoenix, 2.5 ltr 4 banger!)

 

[Desert_Dog]

I have NEVER heard of a spun bearing spinning back in place... Have you called Guinness?

I will chime in on what Smokey said. What was the oil pressure before and after the "incident"... You do watch your oil gauge don't you. You do HAVE an oil gauge don't you?

No offense...

Mike

 

[MoPar_Jamie]

BOTTOM-END REPORT:

Got the motor out of the Truck today and because I had to have the pan and pickup (which I may not use), I got a good look-see! Well, no real loose rods, except side to side play in one, but that dont mean that they arent loose! I'll tear into it more when I get the space in my shop

Anyway, pulled the pan, burnt oil! Bad smell! Buddy that was helping me swirled what litle oil was in the pan, and saw sparkles, definitly metal flakes! Saw it too! So, its time to get into the oil pump, pulled it off, took it to the vise and unscrewed the pickup tube! Pulled the cover and rotor and noticed right off the bad it was galled bad, same with the outer! So, it obviosuly lost pressure, but why?

Well, turns out there was some rattling in the pickup tube! Buddy shook it up and crumbles of what he thought was dirt came out! Well, it turns out that it wasnt dirt, but pieces of nylon gear! The pickup tube was for the most part clogged! So, that explains it! Also may explain why the thing has burned exhaust valves (they're white on the back!) and became hard to start (like too far advanced).

So, my prognosis is sheared nylon timing gear!

Oh ya, the pressure gauge didnt really work, the wire broke of and I hadnt got my Mech one till later! (one day after, go figure, oops)

 

[Guest]

That burnt oil smell was your first clue to pulling that motor and treating it to a fresh re-build. IF you can rebuild that block, make darn sure the oil galleys are cleaned thoroughly. Sounds like it pumped junk thru the entire engine. Good luck

 

[phoenix827]

Guess so, never heard another peep out of it! Pretty sure if it just fell out it would have at least stayed the same if not gotten worse. (and no this was not on a honda! ) Had the car for about a year after that and never had a prob with it. Of course when I sold it the guy put a blower on it and it lasted about 2 weeks!! Blew the whole bottom end apart he said!! Gotta love that motor!! (1981 pontiac phoenix, 2.5 ltr 4 banger!)

Bear with me, I'm having a hard time believing that........the reason is that there are two "tangs" that position the bearing, now one it spins in the bearing cap then the tangs are effectively removed......so there is now no one "place" for it to go back into position. It can spin back to the starting spot, however it won't stop there, it'll continue to spin, generally until it "rolls" the bearing. Unless you pulled the engine apart and could somehow explain what happened I'll have to stick with the belief that it did not spin a bearingJay

right, but wont the edges stop it as it comes back around? Dunno for sure as I am no mech! (just shadetree) .

Something may have happened, but spinning bearings don't make any noise to speak of, it's the noise that happens after they've spun and the tolerences become loose enough that you can hear the metal actually hitting.

YUP! Had a friend that was nice enough to teach me what it sounds like!! Rat in the motor with a sledgehammer sound was there!! Could feel it throught the whole car, No doubts about that!
As far as the other question about oil pressure I have no idea, the light never came on that I saw but had a bit of tunnel vision at the time. I had gotten fired and almost arrested that am, Went for a ride before I went home and was out on a dirt road when I let my top blow. They had re-done part of the road with pea gravel, was still soft and I was bogging down bad. Went to down shift and missed the shift BAD! (saw the nedle stop moving on the tach cus it was so hi kind of bad). Motor started knocking real bad and though it was done. I took it real easy getting out of there and going home, by the time I got home the knocking had stopped. From what I told a few friends/mechanics that was their diagnosis.

 

[phoenix827]

right, but wont the edges stop it as it comes back around? Dunno for sure as I am no mech! (just shadetree) .

Not really, since the "edges" aren't there once the cap is torqued down.......if edges were perceptible then the bearings would never form a perfect circle and thus be too tight on the crank journals in spots. The cap and rod (or block) are machined as one piece (bolted together) specifically to eliminate any edge. Jay

No I mean the edges of the bearing halfs, If one half rides up over the other then won't it only work around once?