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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Well now that I have the lockers in, when I have less than ideal traction, the truck bounces. It can be pretty annoying. Everything is so dry up here the dirt roads are loose, and I bounce.

Is there any thing that can help this situation? I was thinking of maybe trying dual shocks in the rear, or maybe just even new shocks. :eek:

Brian
 

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Sounds like axle wrap to me. I have never had a locker so I can not identify with lockers but it does sound like axle wrap. I would buy or fabricate a set of ladder bars of some sort. I made some for a furd that had limited slip and it got rid of it. (the bounce) Just make sure the rest of the drivetrain can handle it.
 

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mother Mopar makes a kicker shock setup for the rear that works really good
 

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Yea you've got axle wrap, but like someone else said be sure the rest of the drivetrain can handle the ladder bars because once you put those on, where is the force gonna go? Most likely axle shafts, which can cause major carnage.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
DODGEBOYS said:
mother Mopar makes a kicker shock setup for the rear that works really good
Do you have a link that to these?

Brian
 

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Don't worry about the rest of the drivetrain. Worry about the fact that if you put ladder bars on your truck, you will cut your suspension travel down to less than 2" TOTAL, and you will have tons more 'bounce' during daily driving.

When you put ladder bars on, the springs and the ladder bars will rotate on different arcs, and they will 'fight' each other, unless you put leaf spring floaters on the truck, and guess what, they don't make floaters that are safe to use on a truck, because the axle is below the spring, not above like on cars.

The springs rotate on an arc that moves up and back as the spring moves and compresses, but the ladder bars will rotate on a perfect circle from the forward connection point, so after about 1" of travel either up or down, the two arcs will be different enough to cause suspension bind.

I had a set of L & L ladder bars on my truck, and I swear you could feel every cigarette butt you drove over, but the axle wrap was gone. It also bound the suspension so bad, that I could back up a small hill (more like the size of the dirt pile from digging a grave--sorry, but trying to get the size thought accurate) with the right side rear tire on the hill, and I could walk over and turn the left side rear tire by hand because the suspension was so bound up that the weight was almost all off that tire (this was BEFORE the lockers). I actually got stuck one time because of them too. I got high centered on the rear axle, and they would not let the suspension drop enough to let one of the tires touch for traction.

If you can find or make some spring floaters, so that the spring ONLY supports the weight of the vehicle, and the ladder bars control the suspension movement, they will work great, but I am not sure that can be safely done unless you remove the axle block from the rear (basically, the center pin of the springs will be able to move and 'slide' as the suspension moves). I talked to competition engineering, and they told me their fully boxed spring sliders would not work or be safe on a truck axle with the axle beloew the spring and blocks.

I still have a set of home made ladder bars that I put on every now and then, when I know I will have high traction, and no real need for suspension travel (like beach running on sand), when the bars will be more of a benefit than a detriment.

I took the L & L ladder bars off after I broke them the 3rd time as a result of suspension binding.

The best way to get rid of the axle wrap is to remove the block so that the axle has less leverage on the spring, or get tires that have le4ss traxtion, so that they will slip instead of the axle wrapping up.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Ladder bars were never really an option, But I'd really like to know more about the kicker shock. Is that a whole different thing? Only thing I could find was ones made by Rancho and they are for use only with their springs .

Now when it does this the tires are slipping. I go to take off in the driveway and it just digs and bounces, doesn't even move. But like I said it has been very dry here. Roads that have never been a problem are now. Just so dried out the sand is just turning to sand pits, everyone getting stuck just makes big pits, and then I come along and make two big pits. we did get good rain the night before last but it didn't help much.

I mean 4x4 can make it no problem, but I normally ain't cruising around with the hubs locked in. And I don't get out and lock them in until I am dug down and resting on the frame ;D.

I am going to be ordering a lift soon but I don't know if I'll get it done before winter. But going with all spring that should somewhat cure my problem?
 

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TRCM, What about ladder bars and shackleing BOTH ends of the springs? Would that work?
 

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In theory, it would work, but it is not recommended. I asked the same questions of the 'pros' and that was their answer. It could give you some way out pinion angles during axle movement. Think about this, the front shackle is up and the rear shackle is down, and the spring is drooped at it's max, you could almost have the pinion angle at 45 deg to what it was at rest, not to mention the change in d/s length that would result. It would be a fairly cheap way to gain some lift at the same time tho.

What would work, is if you didn't mount the ladder bar end solid to the frame, and instead used a shackle there. As long as the shackle there is at a 90 deg angle to the centerline of the ladder bar at rest, loaded, it will control axle hop, but as the spring/axle moves up and back under compression, the ladder bar will be able to also move up and back, because the forward ladder bar mount will rotate based on the shackle length, instead of a solid mount.



The best way to control axle hop, is to not turn the loud pedal up so much.

Axle hop will occur in deep sand no matter what, because normally, you only have a small contact patch where the tire touches the ground. But in sand, if it is deep, this can grow significantly as the tire sinks into the sand, and if there is enough resistance to not allow the vehicle to move, the rear axle will unload, or hop. I have even had it happen when I had ladders bars on the truck.

Sand is weird. On hard ground, you get better traction moving slow, but on sand, you will get better traction moving fast. I said MOVING fast not tires spinning fast. In sand, as long as you stay moving, you are normally ok, it's when you stop and have to restart that people get in trouble. They either stop too fast, and make holes, or the try to take off too fast, and dig holes.

That is why in deep sand, you ain't supposed to drive like yer at the drag strip...unless ya want to get stuck.

Fine tuning the shackle length and the location of the mount will allow you to get the arcs of rotation very close, but they will never be the same. You can get them close enough to not notice, but it may require the ladder bars to be mounted high inside the frame rails. You also want to get the longest ladder bars you can. Mine mounted right at the tcase cross member on the frame.
 

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Just put a shackle on the front of the ladder bar
 

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The kicker shock setup is actually made by Rancho suspension. Check out there site and see what you can find. Dual shocks on the suspension could probably help too. The Kicker shock setup probably won't eliminate the bounce or axle wrap but it could lesson the amount making it more tolerable.
 
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