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Discussion Starter · #181 ·
Well, you guys are not making this sounds like it will be much fun. Maybe we should just go back to talking about hp and torque, lol. It does sound like it will be easier to use a 4wd frame. Either the one I have or find a different one.
 

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Well, you guys are not making this sounds like it will be much fun. Maybe we should just go back to talking about hp and torque, lol. It does sound like it will be easier to use a 4wd frame. Either the one I have or find a different one.
Post some pics of the rot. We can help you judge from there.

Stripping cleaning and painting should be mandatory on the frame anyway IMHO if you are swapping that many parts. It's a lot more accessible while you have the stuff off . Good wire wheel and sealer is highly encouraged.

Neil
 
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90 w350 6BT Nv4500, 87 D150, 77 W150, 83 W150
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Funny that you didn’t find these:
Or this:

Thats just ten minutes doing a quick search….



But thats not what you said



A 5.9 Magnum makes either [email protected] or [email protected] , in bone stock form depending on version. Thats not exactly 350lb-ft.

Check out the first half of this vid where they ran a motorhome 440;

Heres some interesting numbers for ya. They dynoed a bone stock 440 motorhome motor, with exception to headers.
In stock form that RV 440 made;
[email protected] [email protected]

Remember what the 5.9 Magnum made, horsepower-wise?
here are those numbers;
[email protected] for a base 5.9 Mag
[email protected] for an HO 5.9 Mag

So hp vs hp, the RV 440 with its lame compression ratio, still makes more factory hp, +89hp over the base Mag, +74hp over the HO

How about torque?
[email protected] for a base 5.9 Mag
[email protected] for the HO 5.9 Mag

Tq vs Tq, the RV makes more overall torque, +127lb-ft over the base Mag, +117lb-ft over the HO

The video goes on to show that after installing a cam, dual plane intake and an 850cfm carb, the RV 440 pumped out;
[email protected]
[email protected]
Keep in mind thats still on an anemic 7.5:1 compression ratio!

And just for the sake of comparisons, a typical early 70s 440 put out;
[email protected]
[email protected]

That means despite the weak sauce compression, the RV version made more hp +31hp over the base 440 but slightly less torque -4lb-ft.

The numbers don’t lie, and you’re never going to get 120 or more lb-ft more torque out of a 360 with a cam, intake, headers, or head work. insane huh?

Ed
Just a note your comparing net hp of the magnum vs gross dyno hp of the 440 here. 1971 and later are net ratings. 360 magnum crate engine 310hp 400 torque stock truck motor.
 

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On the 2wd vs 4wd cabs, if you can find a bolt in transmission cover from a 70s truck you can use it to make a pattern of what needs cut out on the 2wd cab and make a removable tramsmission cover
 

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Just a note your comparing net hp of the magnum vs gross dyno hp of the 440 here. 1971 and later are net ratings. 360 magnum crate engine 310hp 400 torque stock truck motor.
Then lets compare gross vs gross
But first, check out this video first;


The video shows a basic junk yard 5.9 Magnum, unknown mileage, first part is completely stock including exhaust manifolds hooked to the dyno.

Results with stock manifolds:
288hp and 386lb-ft

and with headers;
300hp and 399lb-ft

Here are the numbers for the RV 440 again;
319hp and 452lb-ft

In every circumstance the 440 makes more hp and torque then the 360, because cubic inches does matter. Cubic inches can even offset weaker compression ratios.

Ed
 
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'79 Macho 360 Magnum, Comp 480 cam, Hughes springs, 650 Thunder AVS, Pertronix Flamethrower ignition
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The 30 ft lbs of torque difference is in the advertised statistics. What they produce on the dyno is a different story and not what I'm using as basing the numbers on. As advertised they are only 30 ft lbs apart.
 

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'79 Macho 360 Magnum, Comp 480 cam, Hughes springs, 650 Thunder AVS, Pertronix Flamethrower ignition
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Oh my goodness, this has gotten way out of hand. I appreciate all of the responses, but I am more confused than I was when I started. Here is what I am going to do for the time being.

I bought a 1989 W350, 360/727/205, dana 60's front and back. It is really pretty rusty, the body, cab mounts, frame, all of it is pretty bad. I didn't realize it was this bad until I got it home and started crawling under it. It has a bad vibration/drowning when driving it. I think it is the tires, mud tires that are scalloped pretty bad.

Last night I bought me another truck, 1988 D150, 318/727 (I believe), for cheap. It is in really good shape, barely any rust, no dents, interior is in great shape. The kid told me that he drove it around the block and it overheated then squirrels have chewed the wires to the throttle position sensor in half. Didn't have a battery so I towed it to walmart and put a battery in it, fired right up, drove it home the 20 miles, no overheating, everything works on it so far. Well almost everything, no wipers and I haven't checked the cruise control. It was idling extremely high, assuming that it is the TPS wiring causing that issue.

So here is what I am planning on doing, remember, when I say "heavy" towing or hauling, it probably doesn't classify as the same as some of you. The most I have ever hauled was a 10K skid steer on a trailer and that was only one time. A half a dozen times I have put 2 ton of gravel in the bed of a truck. The rest of the time, it is my boat and camping trailer. Boat probably weighs in at 3K and hunting trailer to Colorado is probably 5K, these are just guesses.

To make this simple to explain and not write a book, I am going to swap the running gear from the 89 W350 and put it under the 88 D150. My main question is, will the frame hold up to what I have mentioned above that I have hauled? I don't want to create a dangerous situation for myself.

I am going to take the 360 from the 89 and go thru it and make sure all of the bearings are good, put a low end torque cam in it, aftermarket intake, 1.6 roller rockers, holley sniper, and MSD ignition. I would like recommendations on the mentioned items as to what would work best to produce low end torque. On the holley sniper, will it control the timing on the MSD ignition or do I have to go with the holley ignition?

Thanks for everyone's input, it has been interesting reading, but it has just gotten me more confused.
Ya, sorry 'bout that, some of us tend to off on our own little conversations or debates. You can ignore those if you like. Lol
 

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Then lets compare gross vs gross
But first, check out this video first;


The video shows a basic junk yard 5.9 Magnum, unknown mileage, first part is completely stock including exhaust manifolds hooked to the dyno.

Results with stock manifolds:
288hp and 386lb-ft

and with headers;
300hp and 399lb-ft

Here are the numbers for the RV 440 again;
319hp and 452lb-ft

In every circumstance the 440 makes more hp and torque then the 360, because cubic inches does matter. Cubic inches can even offset weaker compression ratios.

Ed
Yes and i dont deny that. I'm a huge fan of a 440. All i was saying is that a 5.9 Magnum is CLOSE! in power to the 440 - not MORE powerful, and of course I am referring to stock to stock AND I was saying that - for the money - a Magnum is a better choice.
 

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Keeping your 360 and hopping it up is the cheapest option in my opinion. The second cheapest option is to get a Magnum and then do it up. The big block will the most expensive option. A Magnum engine can easily perform as strong as a big block - so can an LA 360 to be honest and much lighter than a big block. Don't get me wrong, I love 440's but the 360 is a pretty stout engine with a little bit of work.
Wanna race? ;D
 

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Then lets compare gross vs gross
But first, check out this video first;


The video shows a basic junk yard 5.9 Magnum, unknown mileage, first part is completely stock including exhaust manifolds hooked to the dyno.

Results with stock manifolds:
288hp and 386lb-ft

and with headers;
300hp and 399lb-ft

Here are the numbers for the RV 440 again;
319hp and 452lb-ft

In every circumstance the 440 makes more hp and torque then the 360, because cubic inches does matter. Cubic inches can even offset weaker compression ratios.

Ed
I've watched almost every video Richard's put out. That 440 he tested stock also had very mild RV camshaft he mentioned in one of the earlier videos that motor was a Frieburger or dulcich motor he borrowed. I'm not say 360 magnum makes more power the 440 will make more torque. You were comparing gross to net. Comparing 335 net that's around 400 gross to a motor that makes 450 gross with out mention is apples to oranges. 440s are awesome but they are getting hard and 4x4 trans even worse. Easy to find magnums are everywhere and will bolt up to stock trans. OP mention pulling like 3 or 4k lbs on a trailer magnum will do that easy and better mileage unloaded.
 

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Discussion Starter · #194 ·
On the 2wd vs 4wd cabs, if you can find a bolt in transmission cover from a 70s truck you can use it to make a pattern of what needs cut out on the 2wd cab and make a removable tramsmission cover
This sounds like the easiest way of doing it. I will get some pictures this weekend, but if I am remembering correctly, it may just be the back 1/3rd of the frame that is in bad shape. Might just be able to cut that section out and replace it.
 

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Yes and i dont deny that. I'm a huge fan of a 440. All i was saying is that a 5.9 Magnum is CLOSE! in power to the 440 - not MORE powerful, and of course I am referring to stock to stock AND I was saying that - for the money - a Magnum is a better choice.
As I was saying, all things are relative. There are no strict or hard rules. There are exceptions in everything. There are pricey Magnums and cheap 440s. There are some 360s that make more power and some that make less, the same for the 440. In some situations a Magnum could be a better choice, in others, the 440 might be the better choice. Or maybe theres another choice besides the 360 and 440.

Money is relative too, You can buy a weak worn out pos engine for pennies then dump a pile of money into it, to get big numbers, or you can buy a running crate for a ton of cash that already produces big numbers, and not have to do anything to it other than drop it into your favorite ride. Some, sometimes go the extra mile and pay extra money for something, like one ton axle swaps. Or auto to manual swaps, or suspension lifts, etc.

Botton line is, its all up to you.

Ed
 

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I've watched almost every video Richard's put out. That 440 he tested stock also had very mild RV camshaft he mentioned in one of the earlier videos that motor was a Frieburger or dulcich motor he borrowed. I'm not say 360 magnum makes more power the 440 will make more torque. You were comparing gross to net. Comparing 335 net that's around 400 gross to a motor that makes 450 gross with out mention is apples to oranges. 440s are awesome but they are getting hard and 4x4 trans even worse. Easy to find magnums are everywhere and will bolt up to stock trans. OP mention pulling like 3 or 4k lbs on a trailer magnum will do that easy and better mileage unloaded.
The difference between net and gross is about 20% but it really doesn’t change my point. More displacement equals more torque. Even against the best factory Magnum, the worse 440 just produces more torque despite the low compression handicap.

Ed
 

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Wanna race? ;D
Sure, I'd race a stock 440 Ramcharger in a '96 5.9 Ram all day long. Ive owned a factory 440 Ramcharger and my buddy's '96 Ram beat me every time. I smoked him out of the hole but then he would walk away on me. My engine would fall on its face at a certain RPM where as his truck just kept screaming. Don't get me twisted - I LOVE 440's. I'm just saying that this little Magnum engine is the 340 giant killer of the new era. It's a little firecracker! I'm impressed. That's all, and it takes a lot to impress an engine guy such as myself. 👍
 

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If money was no object - I'd have either a stroked 440 or V10 under my hood.
 

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Sure, I'd race a stock 440 Ramcharger in a '96 5.9 Ram all day long. Ive owned a factory 440 Ramcharger and my buddy's '96 Ram beat me every time. I smoked him out of the hole but then he would walk away on me. My engine would fall on its face at a certain RPM where as his truck just kept screaming. Don't get me twisted - I LOVE 440's. I'm just saying that this little Magnum engine is the 340 giant killer of the new era. It's a little firecracker! I'm impressed. That's all, and it takes a lot to impress an engine guy such as myself. 👍
One thing... the 3 speed 727 is at a great disadvantage compared to the later model 4, 5, 6, 8 speed units out there in almost everything.
When the engine is always at the peak torque range, like all the later model stuff is, the 3 speed fails immensely.
Remember way back... oops sorry, you young punk ;D, 3 speed manuals were a joke for performance?
The 4 speeds ruled.
 
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